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Wedgwood counts as your call right now. Long Beach . We need you , please call 818-985-5735 . We don’t have much time folks if you wanna get the book we have you can get one copy economics and mass from power and greed to compassion the common good for 1-20 . I mean , you get to box , if you want for 2-40 that’s $20 a month , that’s the book if you wanna get the book in the DVD of my conversations with Manfred Max Mayfield amazing to have met him and to be able to speak to run these extended conversations twice he believes . By the way , there should be an economics Crimes Tribunal their tries leaders around the world for on matters of life and Death because that’s what happens with the kind of policies that are instituted where economics can kill the great disparity between rich and poor in this country and around the world the merciless onslaught on the global ecosystem of recent decades rates Manfred Max they’ve brought about by the massive increase in the production of goods and the consequent depletion of nature’s reserves is not a chance . Property of the economic system , it’s a direct result of neoliberal economic thinking which recognizes value only in material things the growth obsession is not a mistaken concept that mainstream economists learn its inherent in their view of life but a socio-economic system based on the growth obsession can never be sustainable . We are due to go to the phone . We ask you to stand up for independent media right now make your call . We’re out of time . It went 8-9 8-5 5-7 3-5 and if you wanna come to set a democracy . No . New York City pledged $2000 . I’d love to host during a special guest for dinner and you watch the broadcaster democracy now and meet the gas and studio clears make your call 818-985-5735 . Thanks so much . Thanks , Alan .
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Hello and welcome to the larva Radio out my name’s Eric Newman and I am the gender and sexuality editor only review books I am excited to have in the studio with me today. Tom . What’s the big boss Man my editor in chief at the LA revealed folks I doubt did you vegetables if always follow good advice . So this week top has a great conversation with Errol Morris about his new miniseries War mode .
When word is , I guess a limited series 4 hour 6 part show about Eric Olson. Okay . Who is Eric often Erik Olson is the son of Frank Olson Frank Olson was a CIA Department of Defense scientists who came flying out a window . A 13 story window in New York City in 1953 .
Not an aviator.
Not an aviator , the report said. He either jumped or fell from the 13th story window and Eric Olson was 10-12 years old at the time and all and haunted him and he has spent his entire life trying to get to the bottom of what happened to his father . Why has father either fell or jumped the story takes a major turn in the ’70s , when a report comes out about the CIA’s use of LSD experiments with LSD okay and Frank Olson is mentioned in that report . And so all of a sudden , there’s a new explanation for what happened to him , which is that he was part of an LSD experiment . There are over now and then over time that story starts to fall apart , as well as just a a fascinating Morris loves obsession and so yeah loves obsessive characters of of all stripes and this son is obsessed with this case and and has the body egg exhumed and when he does he finds things that suggests that this was a CIA it had nothing to do with the other students . Nothing to do with chemical and biological warfare , which was also working on and enhanced interrogation techniques , which were happening in Eastern Europe at the time . Wow . And so this is in the ’50s right . So it’s a very in the middle of the story : William Colby . The ex-director at that point of the CIA goes missing goes out in his canoe and a leak into Hampshire and then never is heard from again just as this guy is chasing him down to find out why he killed his father . It’s a very interesting and moment you know this is of 60-year-old 65-year-old event and yet incredibly prescient about the powers of government and the dark powers of the dark parts of the game .
Also very familiar theme for Morris straight yes in stories that are very complicated and don’t have easy answers.
We don’t have easy answers. And we’re not sure at the end I go in and it ways we’re not sure , but it’s just fascinating all the way through and you can put together the conspiracy theory that gives you the most pleasure . Since then , this film .
And it’s on Netflix right now radius. Okay , great . So readers can listen to this conversation and then watch the film immediately afterwards .
And Morris was a pleasure to talk to him.
Well , you’re Dick Morris fan trade war. Okay . Yeah .
I love fest you been now to control. I love Mr. Death these are films that unlike this film in the ones that is most famous for and have no recreations in them . This does have actors playing Frank Olson and right where ABC agents so documentary purists will not like that , but I just think it’s brilliant . This is one of us .
Good films. Okay , well let’s get raided a conversation .
This is Tom lapse into you can gloss interview books here had award winning legendary documentary filmmaker Errol Morris.
Who was returned to the Emerson College studios for a large radio. Thanks so much for coming back and glad to be back and you’re back because you have a new project Wormwood which is in select theaters and on Netflix and it’s a very interesting exploration , like a lot of Errol Morris films it is got a number of different narrative strands going through a number of different layers of narrative . And so as I try to figure out exactly how is gonna say what this film was about . I was a bit of at a loss . How do you describe it .
There are several ways to describe it. One way has just to describe the ANU aren’t story which involves the Death of an Army scientist who was involved in making biological weapons . This is in the late ’40s and early ’50s and just after Thanksgiving November 1953 he went out a window Stadler hotel overlooking the old Penn Station plunged 13 floors to his Death and the question is worthless in the style was an accident . Where was he killed .
In the original Death certificate says he fell or jumped.
When the hell does that mean I think.
And in fact , that’s the thing that kind of haunted his son for many years , is the question of whether what that meant what in hell does that me and his son Erik Olson is obsessed with this case as one might very well be if one’s father died under mysterious circumstances , but he’s obsessed with it for 60 years and even until now trying to figure out exactly what happened. Yes . So when we talk about the film is is the film is the story of Eric Olsen’s search for the truth of what happened .
Think of it like a series of Russian dolls one inside the other inside the other the certainly Frankl since story what he was doing at Fort Dietrich his involvement with biological weapons in the Korean War. There’s also a story about his son who was at Harvard , 22 years later when the Rockefeller commission report was released by the Ford administration and the report identified an unnamed Army scientist who was surreptitiously toast by the CIA with LSD . Here we have a lot of hacker hymns surreptitiously dosed by the CIA with LSD and it was claimed he committed suicide under the influence of drugs .
Well , it’s , it wasn’t this unintended consequence of the experiment. You know I mean a lot of people would take LSD including myself back in a gravelly those same years and not that any of us jumped out of windows , but it would seem to be a convincing story at the time .
I often say that LSD was a red herring and was designed in part. Although I believe he was given LSD story is far more complicated than just a simple drug suicide .
Yes far more complicated matter wanted to any spoilers and that doesn’t matter , in a sense it doesn’t I’d love the Russian doll image for the way this film works because my favorite film of yours is fast cheap and out of control. Thank you , which I think of it as the only great documentary that’s built like a collage , what about where well when would I think is more like a set of Russian dolls narratives a narrative inside an narrative inside and aired .
Except that collage plays a very important exact nihilistic element and theme absolutely without Wormwood because they’re alive because as here , I don’t think there’s one maybe this is not to many 9 , just 3 because.